Welcome to the Big12, TDS

BYU basketball: Defenseless Cougs fall 93-83 at Oklahoma State - Deseret News

Yeah, in a conference as good as the Big 12, anyone can lose to anyone on the road. And as fun as it is, I am not going to bag on BYU basketball too much. They are doing better than I thought they would.


Indeed let’s not be ragging on BYU too much when it comes to basketball. We had a rare win against them in December, but they’ve controlled the rivalry in recent years and are a lock to go dancing whereas we have a lot of work left to be named on selection Sunday. We’ll be facing those same Big12 opponents starting next year and unlike football where there will be a drop in difficulty (may not as much as some seem to feel) in hoops there will be a big step up in difficulty from the Pac12.


We’ll have a similar pillow-soft defense next year.


Yeah…as much as I don’t like BYU and enjoy watching them get rolled in just about everything, the fact our MBB has sucked like a Fujita 5 tornado for a while now kinda feels a bit like “pot meet kettle” here.

Next MBB season is going to be a vortex of wallopings if we don’t get a huge talent and depth upgrade.


the notion that the Big XII is a significantly better basketball conference than the PAC12 is lame. There are several valid reasons that the PAC12 is every bit as formidable, especially historically.

Last time I looked PAC12 had a dozen or more players in the NBA than the Big XII. There’s more talent in the PAC12.

Big XII players fewer conference games, thats a significant difference and a disadvantage to the PAC12.

Byu/Utah are hovering around .500 in conference, does anyone think they would be any better/worse if they switched places? I dont.



byu is doing a little bit better in the B12 than I expected they would, but like most byu (& USU) teams that make the NCAA tournament, I expect them to get worked in the first round like always.

With how bad HS recruiting has been under Smith, the only way we’re even close to .500 next year is with a huge influx of talent from the transfer portal. I’m not sure I see that happening so next year has the potential to be disastrous.


So you don’t watch current basketball. I mean, the Big XII (Based on the teams as of 2024-25 season) will have 2 of the last 3 NCAA Champs. Three teams have played for the title in the last 10 years. How many are in the Pac-12? ZERO. The Pac-12 hasn’t sniffed the Championship since the George Bush admin. Lute Olson was the last Pac-12 coach to win the title and he’s been dead 4 years let alone doing it in the Clinton Administration.

But sure. The Pac-12 is on par with the conference that won the whole thing the last 2 of 3.


The quickest way to get to respectability is NIL, IMO. We showed we can get the Hunty rocking.

Now somebody needs to get out a checkbook.

I almost - almost - feel bad for Sean Miller. He snagged Ayton for only $100K. Dang inflation!


LOL. Even the USA Today Computers say the Pac 12 is #5 to the Big XII’s #1 and the Big XII is adding Arizona next season: College basketball conference ratings – 2022-23 - Jeff Sagarin Ratings

Using “NBA Player” argument the Big XII had 4 guys drafted before the Pac had a guy drafted last year.

5 in the First Round to the P12’s 1.
2 in the Second Round to the P12’s 3.

So, even then… 7 picks to 4 shows where the conference sits now and even more when the conference 1/6th of the first round.


From 1990 to 2021 the Big XII won a single basketball championship.

UNLV won a title as a member of the Big West, that doesnt make the Big West an elite conference?

How about the runs that Gonzaga has had of late. Would you classify the WCC an elite conference because of what the Zags have done. I wouldnt.

In 2021 the PAC12 had 3:teams in the elite 8, it might have been more, but USC and Oregon played each other in the sweet sixteen. I think that is every bit as impressive as a single title run.


LOL. In the 1990-2021 dates you point out the Pac 12 won 2. The Big XII won that in the last 3 years. Which would you rather be joining? The conference that won 2 titles in 24 years or the won that won 2 titles in 3 years?

Oh. The one team who won the title most recently for the Pac 12 is joining the Big XII.

Also, a “Single title run” was done by 2 different teams in the last 3 years while a “Single title run” hasn’t been done by a Pac 12 team since Netscape was the #1 web browser and Mike Leavitt was in his second term as Governor.

I appreciate your distaste for the Big XII, but let’s not bend over to tell lies about something they are better at right now than every other conference.


We are in the Big 12 whether we like it or not. So you don’t have to keep trying to sell it to us.


The irony is I am not trying to “sell you” as much as many are trying to sell others against it. I am looking forward to Utah in the Big XII and look forward to it for my self-interest and it’s the Ute Fanbase that is throwing mud. I am doing posts as I always do in knocking down false arguments and posting future outlooks.

Then again, maybe I should think back to the glory years of Pac 12 Hoops of the 1990s when Utah wasn’t in it? Seriously, the argument had to go back to the 1990s which I love to try and justify a bad faith argument that the Pac 12 is even in the same realm as the Big XII currently in hoops. I tend to keep my scope of argument in the lifetime of most college recruits.


where have I expressed a distaste for the Big XII? Please show me.

I expressed an opinion about a comparison between the two conferences in mens basketball and that the two conferences arent that different or far apart (contrary to popular opinion).

There’s a weird hatred of all things PAC12 from outsiders. Maybe its the conference of champions mantra, I dont know? It will be nice not to get away from that sentiment.


Fair enough. You were saying historically and I glazed over that. FWIW, @boyaremyarmstired tagged me. lol.

I did just look back at the other thread where we discuss football and you were not one of the ones sharing distaste for the Big XII. So my apologies.

However. It is clear the Big XII is more focused on Hoops and it’s growth in recent years and has become a major player with the ACC and in some small part the SEC (the SEC is too inconsistent in hoops to be considered a top 2 conference IMHO).

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I am as well.

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All true. I guess what I was really saying is that they are not the big dog in the West Coast Conference anymore. Trying to beat Gonzaga was their big annual challenge.